Moonlight, Steam & Nimbus?

Hi everyone,

I'm new here but been a lurker for some time now, it's a great site!

I've been waiting for the Nimbus to surface and it's now available from Apple here in the UK however I have noticed Moonlight is now also available from the app store which leaves me with some questions.

Will the Nimbus work well with steam through Moonlight? does it need to use the anolog click buttons to work correctly? I can't remember if steam games use the anolog click at all, I have been using my Xbox one controller with the PC and play mostly FPS games.

Many thanks

Last edited by trakker1 (Nov 12 1:02 AM)

Hey,

Welcome, glad you like the site! 😊

It has been a long time since I tested Moonlight(then called Limelight). When I did, everything worked pretty much perfectly. Analog click could be accessed either as on-screen buttons or from the pause menu. Few games needed it, but it did work well.

Now with that said, I haven't used Moonlight in many months. I no longer have a compatible Nvidia card, so I can't test it now. It probably stick works great, but I don't know for sure. If you get it working, post your impressions here, I'd love to hear them!

Hey,

Moonlight is working great! i love it 😊
but... the Nimbus dosent have analog sticks to press 😢
neither the Mad Catz C.T.R.L.i

can somebody tel me a good controller where you can press the analog sticks?

Unfortunately there are no MFi Controllers that have clicky sticks (L3,R3), it's just not in Apple's MFi Standard something we have been complaining about from the start.
.
The only option is to Jailbreak and use something like a PS4 Dualshock.

I haven't been complaining, I always thought clicky thumbsticks are confusing and Apple was good to get rid of them!

Tell a non-gamer to press "L3" or "R3", see what happens. They're unintuitive.

Germanium wrote:
Hey,
Moonlight is working great! i love it 😊
but... the Nimbus dosent have analog sticks to press 😢
neither the Mad Catz C.T.R.L.i
can somebody tel me a good controller where you can press the analog sticks?

You should be able to access the thumbsticks presses from the Pause overlay, right? Haven't used Moonlight since the beta, but that's how it worked there. Not necessarily idea, but it worked. Also, most games should let you re-map controller inputs, so you can stick whatever command you use the least to the thumbsticks presses

trakker1 wrote:
Will the Nimbus work well with steam through Moonlight? does it need to use the anolog click buttons to work correctly? I can't remember if steam games use the anolog click at all, I have been using my Xbox one controller with the PC and play mostly FPS games.

Most modern FPS games in Steam use the analog clicks. I would imagine Moonlight and Kino Console would both have workarounds for this shortcoming, but I haven't used either of them and cannot say for certain. I'm like you and mostly play FPS games where the analog clicks are often crucial to gameplay. Hopefully Moonlight and Kino Console have good options to remap these functions.

Kevin wrote:
I haven't been complaining, I always thought clicky thumbsticks are confusing and Apple was good to get rid of them!
Tell a non-gamer to press "L3" or "R3", see what happens. They're unintuitive.

They are unintuitive in explaining them ('analog click' or 'L3 and R3'), but during gameplay I find them extremely intuitive and crucial for certain functions. Granted, FPS games get the most use out of these, and I play this genre the most. For other types of games, these buttons often aren't needed. They are, however, a standard element of console and PC gaming (if, like me, you use an Xbox controller), and I think Apple should have included them since they are standard. I know Apple likes to do their own thing, but don't they have gamers working for them that could have spoken up? Just seems strange.

I would argue the only reason FPS games make extensive use of them is because the buttons exist in the first place. If Activision wanted to port Call of Duty to work with MFi controllers, they'd find another way to map those inputs.

In a shooter, the only guaranteed occupied inputs are the analog sticks and the triggers. Beyond those, you have 4 d-pad directions, 4 ABXY buttons, and 2 additional shoulder buttons. If a developer can't find a way to make use of those 10 additional inputs, then their game is probably way too complicated in the first place.

I totally agree they can make their games work without those two inputs. Both Call of Duty and Modern Combat make do just fine.

The real feature of these inputs, though, is that you don't have to take your thumbs off the analog sticks to use them, which can be very useful in FPS games.

I imagine Apple didn't want to include them because they couldn't be pressure sensitive. And since all the buttons are pressure sensitive, it shouldn't be too hard to find work arounds for the lack of two standard inputs.

For "pro gamers", sure, the ability to hit them without removing your thumbs from the triggers is cool. But for Apple's demographic, I imagine it really doesn't matter.

Pressure sensitivity... maybe. The pause button isn't pressure sensitive, though 😜

Hi guys,

Some great posts here, I have since been and bought the Nimbus and it seems to work great for all of the Lego games I've tested o far. The only one I seem to be having some issues with is Lego Worlds, this is using Moonlight from steam pc but when using a Xbox one controller direct to the pc it works great (this isn't related to the L3 and R3 buttons).

I've yet to try any FPS games or any that use the L3 and R3 buttons because I've been busy on my xb1. One thing I'm not happy about, which is one of the main reasons I bought the Nimbus, is Crossy Roads on the iPad Air 2 doesn't work. I've tried uninstalling it and reinstalling but no joy, I'm not impressed and neither is my 6 year old son, we thought it would work with Apple showcasing it on the new Apple TV. I will put my hands up though and say I haven't looked into it much and could be a easy fix.

Last edited by trakker1 (Nov 24 4:48 PM)

Hi Trakker,
I noticed CrossRoad no longer works with MFi Controllers after they updated it to support multiplayer for AppleTV.
Multiplayer works well with a Siri Remote & iPhone/iPod linked to AppleTV, but still not as good as when it had Controller Support, we've emailed HipsterWhale regarding this, waiting on a reply.

Kevin wrote:
For "pro gamers", sure, the ability to hit them without removing your thumbs from the triggers is cool. But for Apple's demographic, I imagine it really doesn't matter.
Pressure sensitivity... maybe. The pause button isn't pressure sensitive, though 😜

It Should be!!!

Sometimes i'm hesitant to pause the game, a little unsure... so if Apple supported some form of intuitive variable analog control to compensate for my indecisive actions this would be nice. 😉

On a serious note:

Do you know how much 5h*t Apple caused by not supporting "Clicky Sticks" in the first place.?
I will give you some examples.
MadCatz C.T.R.L.i controller was delayed for several months due to the 1st batch of controllers using "Clicky Sticks", reason they used them are:
1: The only stick components available are Click Sticks, they are an industry standard component for an analog VR.
2: The MFi Specifications at that time never mentioned they could not be used.
.
So after MFi Approval failed for MadCatZ (solely because of the Clicky Sticks issue) they had to rework the stick by inserting a plastic blocking frame over the 2 Analog VRs which physically stopped you pushing them down.
This plastic frame is present in all C.T.R.L.i controllers, remove it and your will have a "clicky stick" but of course it will do nothing under the MFi Protocol.
.
Same story went for MOGA, the Rebel also has a plastic blocker to stop you pushing down on the stick.
.
All of this waste of time/money for the smaller controller companies could have been avoided if Apple where clear on their initial MFi Guidelines..or simply just supported clickies from the start.
.
Reason i defend this, is because the entire Gaming industries history & controller evolution defines this.,Sony,MicroSoft,Nintendo,Sega,Atari,PC..even ANDROID etc. all support "Clicky Sticks".
.
From a Gaming Genre point of view
The one defining constant that has been the leading game genre for the past 10 years is FPS games. Halo.COD.Battlefield,TitanFall..etc. and this season "Starwars BattleFront".
.
All i see is an Apple 20 years behind this industry, being stubborn in their "the only way is the iphone way".
Look what happened..(is happening) to the standard MFi Controller layout.
Standard layout MFi Controllers where supposed to be for the retro casual crowd, but fact is as of today there are ZERO manufacturers that are making a standard MFi Controller.

The ones that tried, got burnt in believing in Apple's "forsight" of what the direction controller support on Apple system should be.
RIP: Razer Junglecat, Logitech PowerShell
.
The next iteration of MFi Game controllers really does need to support "Clicky Sticks" at some point just to catch up with "What is Expected", this will also allow game developers unification for their genres instead of "working around" to make it compatible for iOS or AppleTV, this is Fragmentation from a game developers point of view.
.
Here endeth the lesson.

Last edited by MFiGamer (Nov 24 9:41 PM)

After trying a good handful of current games from the apple store and them not being supported I have decided now is not the right time to invest any money or time into it so have decided to return the Nimbus for a refund. I knew there would be a lack of games but didn't realise the whole experience would feel so lacking in general.

I will keep coming to these forums though....

MFiGamer wrote:
It Should be!!!
Sometimes i'm hesitant to pause the game, a little unsure... so if Apple supported some form of intuitive variable analog control to compensate for my indecisive actions this would be nice. 😉
On a serious note:
Do you know how much 5h*t Apple caused by not supporting "Clicky Sticks" in the first place.?
I will give you some examples.
MadCatz C.T.R.L.i controller was delayed for several months due to the 1st batch of controllers using "Clicky Sticks", reason they used them are:
1: The only stick components available are Click Sticks, they are an industry standard component for an analog VR.
2: The MFi Specifications at that time never mentioned they could not be used.
.
So after MFi Approval failed for MadCatZ (solely because of the Clicky Sticks issue) they had to rework the stick by inserting a plastic blocking frame over the 2 Analog VRs which physically stopped you pushing them down.
This plastic frame is present in all C.T.R.L.i controllers, remove it and your will have a "clicky stick" but of course it will do nothing under the MFi Protocol.
.
Same story went for MOGA, the Rebel also has a plastic blocker to stop you pushing down on the stick.
.
All of this waste of time/money for the smaller controller companies could have been avoided if Apple where clear on their initial MFi Guidelines..or simply just supported clickies from the start.
.
Reason i defend this, is because the entire Gaming industries history & controller evolution defines this.,Sony,MicroSoft,Nintendo,Sega,Atari,PC..even ANDROID etc. all support "Clicky Sticks".
.
From a Gaming Genre point of view
The one defining constant that has been the leading game genre for the past 10 years is FPS games. Halo.COD.Battlefield,TitanFall..etc. and this season "Starwars BattleFront".
.
All i see is an Apple 20 years behind this industry, being stubborn in their "the only way is the iphone way".
Look what happened..(is happening) to the standard MFi Controller layout.
Standard layout MFi Controllers where supposed to be for the retro casual crowd, but fact is as of today there are ZERO manufacturers that are making a standard MFi Controller.
The ones that tried, got burnt in believing in Apple's "forsight" of what the direction controller support on Apple system should be.
RIP: Razer Junglecat, Logitech PowerShell

Interesting story, I didn't know all of that!

I actually liked the Standard layout. Made sense in the Junglecat / PowerShell form factor, where you could augment it with on-screen buttons. If the PowerShell didn't have a shitty d-pad, sticky buttons, and an inflated price tag, I think it could have been a real success. The Junglecat was an excellent controller - it is sad that didn't launch.

To my knowledge, Apple hasn't discontinued the Standard layout. We might see more controllers supporting it someday.

MFiGamer wrote:
The next iteration of MFi Game controllers really does need to support "Clicky Sticks" at some point just to catch up with "What is Expected", this will also allow game developers unification for their genres instead of "working around" to make it compatible for iOS or AppleTV, this is Fragmentation from a game developers point of view.
.

No, now would be the time that makes the LEAST sense, because manufacturers finally have a handle on making non-clicky sticks! Although both the Nimbus and the Horipad Ultimate have a little flex to the stick if you press down... Mad Catz' plastic solution might have been better 😜

I think Apple doesn't care the slightest bit if developers have to "work around" to make games compatible for iOS. I imagine Apple would WANT developers to think about optimizing their control layouts for iOS, rather than porting without thought.

Bottom line for me: controller manufacturers have been doing "unique" things to their layouts for years. Sony's Sixaxis, Microsoft's vibration triggers, Nintendo's Wiimote, Sony's DS4 touchpad. Apple doesn't chase every path other companies take, nor should they. Clicky sticks are another example. Yes, their widely supported, but that doesn't mean they make any logical sense. Any more than I'd fault Apple for not including the DS4's touchpad.